Which Battle is Better?

[Elysia Shadowmere]

Helm's Deep or Minas Tirith?

Thoughts?

[Aramis Ashpool]

You could lose helm's deep and still have hope that Minas Tirith could turn the tide of war. If you lose Minas Tirith, though... Mankind is fucked. Just saying.

[Garrus Atherton]

Minas Tirith. It showcases each of the sides and really captures a battle for the world. It's so much of a close fight that even the deus ex machina from Rohan isn't the crushing blow it needs to be. Wheras in Helms Deep, that's all it took. One surprise attack from the east and the Uruks flee. In Minas Tirith, it's an actual battle, since they regroup, reform and test their metal again.

[Esme Ainsley]

And we are so tied!!! Don't get me wrong, Minas Tirith is an amazing battle. But there was something just... awesome to me about Helm's Deep. I went to see Two Towers in the theaters three times just to watch that battle on the big screen.

*tears*

[Fallon Sterlyn]

listen, HATERS. Helm's Deep. emotional, epic. tears. elves. Minas Tirith - let's save a crazy old guy.

respect.

[Regina Ambrosios]

Helm's Deep. For all the reasons Friday said.

[Garrus Atherton]

The battle at Minas Tirith isn't to save Denethor! Quite the opposite, infact. It's a battle despite Denethor's madness. Which, for me, only adds to the dramaticalness of it - They're fighting for everyone's sake, even crazy old guy. Helms Deep was avoidable and purely for Rohan.

Selfish, selfish Horse peoples. :)

[Ariana Castell]

Rohan = Horse people.
Mallory = Horse people.
Therefore, Mallory = Rohan.
See what I did there? I need to stop thinking TOK.

Anyways... I agree with Luke. Denethor actually told them to retreat, at which point Gandalf whacked him out cold with his staff ("Abandon your posts, please, flee while you can." ), but this shows that despite Crazy Old Guy not wanting the war, they kept fighting. Which means that it was not for him, but really, for the fate of Middle Earth.
Battle of Minas Tirith was awesome for the following things:
-Battle of Pelennor Fields is very emotional. That speech in the beginning? Shivers.
-Both Merry and Pippin had their moment to shine in the war. The grew in maturity. Especially Pippin.
-Eowyn's "I am no man."
-Legolas killing the Mûmakil and Gimli saying that it still only counts as one kill.

Aside from the battle, one of my favourite parts in Return of the King was when they lit the fires and one by one they showed up all over Middle Earth. I loved that.

Helm's Deep was amazing, but Minas Tirith was the better battle.

[Liam Coleville]

The battle at Minas Tirith isn't to save Denethor! Quite the opposite, infact. It's a battle despite Denethor's madness. Which, for me, only adds to the dramaticalness of it - They're fighting for everyone's sake, even crazy old guy. Helms Deep was avoidable and purely for Rohan.

Selfish, selfish Horse peoples. :)

'Dramaticalness' is not a real word. Negative one vote for Minas Tirith. And negative five in grammar points for Lewk.

also... Helm's Deep forever! *flees*

[Alexei Milov]

I picked Helm's Deep but acknowledge Minas Tirith for the "I am no man" awesomeness. Basically, Eowyn.

[Tybalt]

OK here comes the expert *cough cough*


In my PROFESSIONAL ;) opinion, Helms Deep is a MUCH better fight, it showcases the true emotions of war, the last moments of despair, everyone is almost out of light, the orcs are about to take the keep! Ride out! Ride out! One last act of heroism, and Gandalf and his riders appear, sparking a full retreat after a night of siege and war.


Minas Tirth, on the other hand - there's really never any "omg!" effect, the main heroes aren't there until the end, it's pretty much Gandalf / Pippin for the most part, then side-heroes such as Theoden, Eomer, Eowyn, etc. don't show up until Rohan arrives, and that's without the other main heroes Aragorn / Gimli / Legolas, they don't show up until they have this invincible army... which confuses me why Aragorn just doesn't have them do a quick sweep into Mordor, allowing them to pretty much just march in and destroy the ring.. noooo, Aragorn and his pride have to let the worn-out humans do it. Stupiddd.


SOOOOO

[/nerd]

[Michael Miridian]

The dispute I would make about the last act of heroism is that Aragorn remembers Gandalf is coming. Instead of riding out in one stupid last stand (Notice, in the film too, that they let Orcs into the Keep and DON'T KILL THEM) they should have stayed and fought there to defend the people until the end. Instead, to try and make the king into less of a pansy, Aragorn has to convince him to do something stupid.

After rewatching it, too, I really don't see the despair. Most of it follows Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas being invulnerable and everyone else taking the brunt of their damage. Wheras in Minas Tirith, purely because it is indeed lesser heroes, you see a catastrophic amount of damage slung around. Net result, Helms Deep - Dead Haldir (Who shouldn't have been there anyway, by the way) Minas Tirith - Theoden dead, Eowyn, Merry and Faramir all injured something horribly and the heroes have a plausible reason for being so powerful - They are accompanied by hoardes of dead soldiers who are invincible.

In the setting, I find Minas Tirith far more believable and dramatic. Also, bear in mind who does the damage in both battles. Gandalf saves the day in Helms Deep, who is another main "invincible" character. Rohan, with their minor heroes, breaks the lines and turns the tide in Minas Tirith. Eowyn slays the witch king (Yet another "minor" hero) and for me, that's important. It stops Minas Tirith becoming a "Watch what these guys do despite all these setbacks" and instead turns it into...ya know...a battle :)

Also, the logic with the "battle" of the Black Gate holds only if the oathbreakers did as they were told. Aragorn's deal was form them to fight that battle with him, which he would hold their oaths fulfilled after if they did. He breaks that oath and they have already shown they aren't always true to their word. They could have killed everyone in spite, thinking they were resigned to servitude anyway. So in effect, Aragorn did the right thing.

Not that I'm that sad that I study it. :)